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Old 01-14-2007, 11:15 PM   #21
Feslin
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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What was that called in the 20's? You know, when bread was reduced to a nickel a loaf, but nobody had a nickel and the highest paying labor job was 2 bucks a month?

The Great what?



I bet your Father didn't live through it like mine did. Believe me, literature only touched a spec of why and how and what an unregulated market can do because of panic and greed.
The 20's was not an unregulated market. A true unregulated market has never existed in the modern age. They were mercentalist back then.

If you have someone on ignore because you don't like their opinions, do us all a favor and just leave, moron.
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Old 01-15-2007, 03:42 PM   #22
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

wasn't the 20's becaue everyone wanted to sell their stocks at the same time, and noone wanted to buy them? Or am I totally missing the point?

If people where to put down their guns and their grudges maybe, just maybe, the human race wont self destruct, and scatter the peices throught the cosmos.
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Old 01-15-2007, 05:00 PM   #23
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

Ok, here's the one page history lesson on the period of time as I don't have the time or typing to write it all out here, and it's a good page.

H102 Lecture 18: The Crash and the Great Depression

Now here is what they didn't put into the books.

My Father was a Farmer during that time, one of the very few who didn't owe anything to the banks when the market crashed. There was NO minimum wage during that time, and didn't get set until 1938, one of the motivations to set one was because of the Depression.

Why?

It was a downward spiral. People had their hours and money cut down to reflect the reduced profits of the businesses, and people had less money to buy with. With less money, profits and income went down even further, and more jobs were cut and lost. Wages were reduced and no floor was set, some people were making 35 cents a week and that was considered a lot of money.

When all that 'paper' money vanished off the face of the banking industry and people scrambled to get their 'cash' out of the banks, something the fault of the still newish Federal Reserve was responsible for back then, the banks simply didn't have it to give back. They had no gold for the paper reciet, the dollar bill. Back then, banks issues the dollars. I still have a 10 dollar note from the bank of Erie, PA, dated 1929. No gold and no cash.

My Father had 17 acres of corn, 20 acres of wheat and 150 acres of oats. The stores didn't have the money to buy it because nobody was buying from the stores hardly. So he set up stalls of his own by the road and would sell 2 bushels for 10 cents. He then lowered it to a nickel, and then he had to give it away as it was going bad.

Nobody had the money to afford transportation of even small loads of the produce. My Father ate his own crops and it's why he and the rest of my Family in the area didn't starve to death.

With no minimum wage to provide an economic floor, with no social programs to put money back into the market even from the poorest American, enitre families literally starved to death with farmers who had granneries filled with food that was going to eventually spoil, those who were not in the drought areas.

Back then, there was no world wide media or anything that would record horrific and tragic events in the boonies. But I have no reason to disbelive it when my Father pulled his cart with his horses 250 miles to a town he heard that had people starving to death. He was going to give the entire cart load of corn and wheat to them for survival, he couldn't afford to put gas in either of his two trucks. He would have made two or three trips if necessary becuase of the situation. You see, he fed everybody in walking distance back then who came to him.

He didn't make it in time. At first, he thought it had become a ghost town and everybody had left, which happened a lot in small communties back then. But it just didn't feel right to him, and he started to check for people. It was a ghost town all right, but nobody had left. He merely turned around and passed out what he had to homes on the way back to his farm.

Now, today, like what happened in the last Recession of the early 90's, we had a minimum wage floor and social programs for the unemployed, which is like a safety net. They pump cash back into a hurt economy and revitalize the cash flow from the bottom up, taking the harsh edge of the economic recovery from the Federal Reserve.

No more small towns starving to death. I take that as a superior position to what it used to be, with no minimum wage.

Only posting within a narrow window of a few days, then I'll be offline again for a few more months. I'll write what I can, but dialup bites when I'm used to broadband.

I miss you guys.
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Old 01-15-2007, 05:14 PM   #24
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Oberdan View Post
My Father was a Farmer during that time, one of the very few who didn't owe anything to the banks when the market crashed. There was NO minimum wage during that time, and didn't get set until 1938, one of the motivations to set one was because of the Depression.
Wait. Weren't the farmers some of the most in debt, because the had to buy seed and harvesting equipment,sometimes with money they didnt have?

If people where to put down their guns and their grudges maybe, just maybe, the human race wont self destruct, and scatter the peices throught the cosmos.
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Old 01-17-2007, 02:12 PM   #25
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Properman View Post
In southern states, busseness are unknowingly hiring illegal immigrants.
Bull. One of the things employers are supposed to do is to call in to the Socialist Security Administration and check if the supplied SSN is valid.

MYOB. - The key to liberty. Don't know MYOB? Leave me alone and mind your own business.

I'm a greedy selfish bastard, and damn proud of it.

You're not foolish enough to trust government, are you? Then think about this:

Since there isn't any corn on the cob, thanks solely to government interference, my kids have lost the freedom to eat corn on the cob on the Fourth of July this year.

What the hell kind of country are the socialists building here?
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Old 01-17-2007, 02:28 PM   #26
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Oberdan View Post
No more small towns starving to death. I take that as a superior position to what it used to be, with no minimum wage.
How about the superior position that if the Wilson Administration hadn't created the Federal Reserve System the monetary system could never have gotten so screwed up that a Great Depression was inevitable.

Now, you're arguing that because the government interference made the Great Depression possible that the government should also interfere to alleviate that symptoms of it's previous ineptness.

Before the banking system was nationalized, the fiscal crises were small and manageable, with only specific sectors being slowed down at any one time. It took the federal government to mess up the whole country all at once.

Clearly, turning to the feds to fix a problem is a bad idea.

Also...if a company can't afford to pay a minimum wage, like say in the Great Depression,...they go bankrupt, and the former workers get to discover a new minimum wage anyway: Zero. In other words, setting a minimum wage won't prevent people from not having money.

MYOB. - The key to liberty. Don't know MYOB? Leave me alone and mind your own business.

I'm a greedy selfish bastard, and damn proud of it.

You're not foolish enough to trust government, are you? Then think about this:

Since there isn't any corn on the cob, thanks solely to government interference, my kids have lost the freedom to eat corn on the cob on the Fourth of July this year.

What the hell kind of country are the socialists building here?
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Old 01-17-2007, 02:33 PM   #27
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Properman View Post
without minimum wage and welfare, we would have a 100% unemployment rate and 100% poverty rate.
Say what?

Go get a clue.

MYOB. - The key to liberty. Don't know MYOB? Leave me alone and mind your own business.

I'm a greedy selfish bastard, and damn proud of it.

You're not foolish enough to trust government, are you? Then think about this:

Since there isn't any corn on the cob, thanks solely to government interference, my kids have lost the freedom to eat corn on the cob on the Fourth of July this year.

What the hell kind of country are the socialists building here?
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Old 01-17-2007, 02:36 PM   #28
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Feslin View Post
This is why we have to put illegals on our farms and such. If the owners paid minimum wage they would make no profit, and would just lose money.
That's not true. If farmers had to pay their laborers minimum wage, the cost of food would rise. Unless you're assuming that people stop buying food when it gets too expensive.

The only reason that farmers get to skate on the minimum wage is that they have powerful lobbies in Washington and the state capitols. It's just a symptom of the corruption of the age you live in.

MYOB. - The key to liberty. Don't know MYOB? Leave me alone and mind your own business.

I'm a greedy selfish bastard, and damn proud of it.

You're not foolish enough to trust government, are you? Then think about this:

Since there isn't any corn on the cob, thanks solely to government interference, my kids have lost the freedom to eat corn on the cob on the Fourth of July this year.

What the hell kind of country are the socialists building here?
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Old 01-17-2007, 02:39 PM   #29
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Oberdan View Post
I bet your Father didn't live through it like mine did. Believe me, literature only touched a spec of why and how and what an unregulated market can do because of panic and greed.
Not if it's discussing the Great Depression, which is the historical example of how regulation fucked things up royally.

MYOB. - The key to liberty. Don't know MYOB? Leave me alone and mind your own business.

I'm a greedy selfish bastard, and damn proud of it.

You're not foolish enough to trust government, are you? Then think about this:

Since there isn't any corn on the cob, thanks solely to government interference, my kids have lost the freedom to eat corn on the cob on the Fourth of July this year.

What the hell kind of country are the socialists building here?
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Old 01-17-2007, 05:01 PM   #30
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Default Re: illegal immigrant deportation

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Originally Posted by Freedom for All View Post
Say what?

Go get a clue.
This has already been discussed, I know that I was wrong.

If people where to put down their guns and their grudges maybe, just maybe, the human race wont self destruct, and scatter the peices throught the cosmos.
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