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01-28-2007, 04:07 PM
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#1
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Banned
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 607
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Ebay....what we all knew
CUSTOMERS of the internet auction site eBay are being defrauded by unscrupulous dealers who secretly bid up the price of items on sale to boost profits. An investigation by The Sunday Times has indicated that the practice of artificially driving up prices — known as shill bidding — is widespread across the site.
NI_MPU('middle');
Last week one of the UK’s biggest eBay sellers admitted in a taped conversation with an undercover reporter that he was prepared to use business associates to bid on his goods for him.
Our inquiries found evidence that a number of businesses — ranging from overseas property agencies to car dealerships — have placed bids on their own items using fake identities.
The cases raise questions about whether eBay, the world’s biggest auction site, is doing enough to protect consumers.
Shill bidding is against eBay rules and is illegal under the 2006 Fraud Act. However, the resulting higher prices on the site boost the value of eBay’s share of the sales.
Last November eBay changed its rules to conceal bidders’ identity — making it even more difficult for customers to see whether sellers are bidding on their own lots. Since its launch seven years ago, eBay’s UK website has attracted more than 15m customers. It sells more than 10m items at any given time.
One of the beneficiaries of the boom is Eftis Paraskevaides, a former gynaecologist, from Cambridgeshire. He has become a “Titanium PowerSeller” — one of eBay’s handful of top earners — selling more than Ł1.4m worth of antiquities a year on the site.
In a conversation with an undercover reporter last week, Paraskevaides claimed shill bidding was commonplace on eBay.
When the reporter asked whether he arranged for associates to bid on his own items, he replied: “Well, if I put something really expensive (up for sale) and I was concerned that it was going for nothing, I would phone a friend of mine, even a client of mine who buys from me, and say: For Christ’s sake, I sell you 100 quids’ worth of items a week . . . just put two grand on it, will you?” The reporter was posing as a seller of valuable antiquities. He inquired whether Paraskevaides could sell them on eBay and guarantee a minimum price.
He replied: “Leave it to me (laughs). Don’t call it shill bidding. Then I won’t be accused of shill bidding. Yes. I mean — I’ve got people.
“I’ve got some of my big clients who buy big items off me, I look after them. So I can get on the phone to America and say: Mr XXXX . . . you’re a multi- millionaire. You buy a hundred grand’s worth off me a year. Do me a favour would you. Just put — yeah. Exactly.”
He claimed eBay would never follow up a complaint against him for shill bidding because he generated about Ł15,000 a month in commission for the company. “Are they going to ban somebody who’s making them the best part of 15 grand a month? No,” he said.
After being told that he had been talking to an undercover reporter, Paraskevaides denied that he had ever shill bidded on eBay and claimed he was talking about clients who sometimes bid on expensive items if they wished to protect the price.
However The Sunday Times discovered businesses that have been bidding on their own items. One leading dealer from London admitted last week that that he had shill bidded in the past.
A spokesman for eBay said he expected that the company would now launch an investigation into Paraskevaides. Anyone caught shill bidding risks a permanent ban.
The spokesman added: “The change to the way bidder IDs are shown has already resulted in a safer environment for users.”
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01-28-2007, 04:30 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Europe
Age: 55
Posts: 1,766
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenextbesthang
CUSTOMERS of the internet auction site eBay are being defrauded by unscrupulous dealers who secretly bid up the price of items on sale to boost profits. An investigation by The Sunday Times has indicated that the practice of artificially driving up prices — known as shill bidding — is widespread across the site.
NI_MPU('middle');
Last week one of the UK’s biggest eBay sellers admitted in a taped conversation with an undercover reporter that he was prepared to use business associates to bid on his goods for him.
Our inquiries found evidence that a number of businesses — ranging from overseas property agencies to car dealerships — have placed bids on their own items using fake identities.
The cases raise questions about whether eBay, the world’s biggest auction site, is doing enough to protect consumers.
Shill bidding is against eBay rules and is illegal under the 2006 Fraud Act. However, the resulting higher prices on the site boost the value of eBay’s share of the sales.
Last November eBay changed its rules to conceal bidders’ identity — making it even more difficult for customers to see whether sellers are bidding on their own lots. Since its launch seven years ago, eBay’s UK website has attracted more than 15m customers. It sells more than 10m items at any given time.
One of the beneficiaries of the boom is Eftis Paraskevaides, a former gynaecologist, from Cambridgeshire. He has become a “Titanium PowerSeller” — one of eBay’s handful of top earners — selling more than Ł1.4m worth of antiquities a year on the site.
In a conversation with an undercover reporter last week, Paraskevaides claimed shill bidding was commonplace on eBay.
When the reporter asked whether he arranged for associates to bid on his own items, he replied: “Well, if I put something really expensive (up for sale) and I was concerned that it was going for nothing, I would phone a friend of mine, even a client of mine who buys from me, and say: For Christ’s sake, I sell you 100 quids’ worth of items a week . . . just put two grand on it, will you?” The reporter was posing as a seller of valuable antiquities. He inquired whether Paraskevaides could sell them on eBay and guarantee a minimum price.
He replied: “Leave it to me (laughs). Don’t call it shill bidding. Then I won’t be accused of shill bidding. Yes. I mean — I’ve got people.
“I’ve got some of my big clients who buy big items off me, I look after them. So I can get on the phone to America and say: Mr XXXX . . . you’re a multi- millionaire. You buy a hundred grand’s worth off me a year. Do me a favour would you. Just put — yeah. Exactly.”
He claimed eBay would never follow up a complaint against him for shill bidding because he generated about Ł15,000 a month in commission for the company. “Are they going to ban somebody who’s making them the best part of 15 grand a month? No,” he said.
After being told that he had been talking to an undercover reporter, Paraskevaides denied that he had ever shill bidded on eBay and claimed he was talking about clients who sometimes bid on expensive items if they wished to protect the price.
However The Sunday Times discovered businesses that have been bidding on their own items. One leading dealer from London admitted last week that that he had shill bidded in the past.
A spokesman for eBay said he expected that the company would now launch an investigation into Paraskevaides. Anyone caught shill bidding risks a permanent ban.
The spokesman added: “The change to the way bidder IDs are shown has already resulted in a safer environment for users.”
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Bother that reminds me I was going to bid on some crockery on E-bay - too late now 
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History is written by the victors
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01-28-2007, 07:23 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Born & raised in Brooklyn, now living in a small town in PA.
Age: 35
Posts: 14,934
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
It's all about the Benjamins on eBay and sites like it. If someone who makes those sites a measly $20.00 every few months shill bids, they're in trouble, if someone's making them $15,000 a month they let it slide.
It reminds me of another site where they allow criminals to sell illegal items, everything from counterfeit goods to illegal steroids and they do nothing. If you look through these sellers' recent sales, they're selling hundreds and hundreds of dollars worth of items a WEEK. Some of these sellers have been with the site since it's conception. As long as peopleare making these sites rich, they can pretty much do whatever the hell they want.
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01-29-2007, 12:41 AM
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#4
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Lake Geneva, Wisconsin
Age: 20
Posts: 361
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
Well...what can they do about it. If the dealer of illegal drugs (for example) lives in Turkey and they don't have any regulations in Turkey on what they sell, America can do nothing about it despite whatever laws have been inacted.
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01-29-2007, 01:10 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,179
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
[QUOTEIt reminds me of another site where they allow criminals to sell illegal items, everything from counterfeit goods to illegal steroids and they do nothing. If you look through these sellers' recent sales, they're selling hundreds and hundreds of dollars worth of items a WEEK. Some of these sellers have been with the site since it's conception. As long as peopleare making these sites rich, they can pretty much do whatever the hell they want.][/quote]
Yes and if you question it they will ban you. 
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01-29-2007, 01:15 AM
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#6
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Moderator
Staff
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,271
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
I personally don't have a problem with shill bidding. Everything has a price and if you can find someone foolish enough to pay you more than it is worth, more power to you. Or maybe someone is willing to pay more because of some personal value to them. On Ebay, if you use it, everybody should win. Don't pay more than you think it is worth. If you can do that and the seller sells for that price then you make out the seller makes out and Ebay makes out everybody wins. I do like the way half.com operates though. I sell textbooks there and the buyer pays half.com directly and then half.com pays me. The only downside is I have to wait for my money, they only pay twice a month.
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01-29-2007, 01:21 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,179
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
Quote:
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I do like the way half.com operates though
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So do I it's a good place to buy and sell.
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01-29-2007, 07:53 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Born & raised in Brooklyn, now living in a small town in PA.
Age: 35
Posts: 14,934
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jet
Well...what can they do about it. If the dealer of illegal drugs (for example) lives in Turkey and they don't have any regulations in Turkey on what they sell, America can do nothing about it despite whatever laws have been inacted.
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Hmm, considering the site is based IN the US, they can easily DELETE the offending accounts. Pretty simple, don't you think?
Quote:
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Originally Posted by freecell
Yes and if you question it they will ban you.
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Yes, what a wonderful place!! Maybe we should combine our resources and buy some prostitutes and sell them there. I'm sure we can make a killing. Oh wait, I seem to remember a woman selling sex on there, I bet she's still there. We'll have to think of something else to sell.... hmmmm. Maybe we can sell children?
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01-29-2007, 01:49 PM
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#9
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Lake Geneva, Wisconsin
Age: 20
Posts: 361
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
No shit...I'm posing an example of how the US could NOT do anything about it if it was BASED in ANOTHER country.
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07-03-2008, 05:01 AM
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#10
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2
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Re: Ebay....what we all knew
eBay introduces absolute anonymity for (shill) bidders
A submission to government and others regarding unconscionable conduct by the online auction facilitator, eBay
3 July 2008
eBay is a very large international company with such a market share of the online auction business that their behaviour has to be viewed as “monopolistic” in nature.
As an eBay “junkie”, predominantly a buyer, my principal concern with eBay is their recent introduction of whole-of-auction absolute anonymity of bidders to their Australian and, more recently, UK sites, and undoubtedly coming again(?) to the US. I consider this action to be unprincipled, unethical, reprehensible, even unconscionable; however you look at it, it is outrageous.
eBay has now obscured auction bidding to the point that genuine bidders have got absolutely no chance of detecting and thereby protecting themselves from “shill” bidding (a criminal offence in most civilised countries) by unethical vendors. Notwithstanding eBay’s statements to the contrary, this application of absolute anonymity by eBay serves no purpose other than to deceive consumers; and the same criticism has always applied to eBay’s other facility, “User ID kept private” (aka “the shill bidders’ stairway to paradise”). Again, notwithstanding eBay’s various pronouncements about shill bidding being banned on eBay, eBay is now knowingly “aiding and abetting” such shill bidders, at the expense of consumers.
What reason could eBay have for increasing the level of bidding anonymity from that of a bidder-specific level (as currently used in the US) to an absolute level? The only possible reason can be to make shill bidding “disappear”. If shill bidding cannot be detected, then genuine bidders cannot report it and, as a consequence, eBay will not have to waste any of their valuable resources pretending to do anything about it.
The balance of the above comment (on AuctionBytes.com)
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=6498345#6498345
On the eBay “naughty chair” again!
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=6498570#6498570
eBay Australia mandates PayPal as sole payment method
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23275
A comment on the new eBay feedback system
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23383
eBay introduces absolute anonymity for (shill) bidders
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23227
eBay plea: Help needed reporting blatant listing violations
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23341
An invitation to eBay: minutes of meetings
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23326
Feedback changes in offing?
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23126
UpcomingLicensingHearingCouldImpactManyeBaySellers
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23323
Psychopaths in the Workplace
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=23338
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